Here's a great opportunity for Minnesota fossil freaks: Minnesota Atheists is organizing a fossil hunting trip to Lilydale park on Saturday, 20 June. Sign up and go collect 440-480 million year old marine fossils. Maybe I'll have to rummage around and find my old rock hammer.
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Sweet! Gotta make an effort to get to this event!
One of my first fossil hunting sites, forty years ago. Still go occasionally, there are huge blocks of limestone that are more fossils than matrix, it's amazing. Lots of crinoids and brachiopods. I like hunting solo, though, so good luck to y'all and have fun.
FLOOD EVIDENCE YAY!
Keep your eyes peeled for human footprints.
Quick story:
My music partner and fellow rockhound took his then-three-year-old daughter to Lilydale for her first fossil hunt (downstream of the old brick factory). She was excited and hoped to find a trilobite (they're there, but rare). Years of looking for agates and fossils had never produced a trilobite for either of us, but the three-year-old little girl found (half of) one as her first fossil.
Awesome! I went on a trip like this on a field trip in the 5th grade. It was ridiculously fun, and I'd love to go on one again.
AssProf PZ: After you locate your rock hammer, please do all those misfortunate enough to read your blog the courtesy of smashing a couple of your fingers with it. You might be forced to type less, which would be better for us all.
@7
Why do you keep coming here if it pains you so? Masochist or asshole?
And yet, Robert, you're still here...
And if you can't wait for June, the Friends of Lilydale Park will be having a fossil hunt on May 23rd: http://www.lilydalepark.org/4th%20Saturday.pdf
Robert seems to be another of those drive-by shouters. Listen, it only works if you quickly drive away before the insulted person catches up to you. Move to another blog and yell, because you're about to get slammed down here.
Ha ha ha, more like Minnesota Satanists.
Going to get some of those fossils that Satan buried to fool the righteous. Satan's little helpers, they.
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/6mb592
Dang! I'd love to go to that, but its the same day as Grandma's marathon.
Is it hard to get a permit to fossil hunt there?
"but the three-year-old little girl found (half of) one as her first fossil."
Well, sure. Kids are perfect for fossil hunting.
They have sharp eyes and are close to the ground! Add some "learns fast", "enthusiastic", and "loves to climb all over the rocks" and they're certain to find all the really good stuff.
Well there is a well formed argument.
What exactly do you have against fossil hunting?
Hank@13
The whole Mississippi corridor is open for rockhounding. From the Ford dam downstream you can find all kinds of cephalopods and stuff, Lake Superior agates (they tend to be pretty broken up) some bits of petrified wood, lovely bits of jasper, all kinds of cool rocks. It's public, and though part of the National Parks system, there are no restrictions that I can think of (though some of the trash is rather scary-condoms and needles and that sort of thing-it's urban whaddya expect?).
Those fossils look a lot like the ones that wash up on the shore of Lake Michigan. Does anyone know if they are from the same period?
Some of my favorite memories of being a kid involved being 30 feet up a rock face (next to the highway), knocking out shell fossils from a vein of stone so soft I occasionally levered them out with my fingers instead of the hammer. My family did that all the time. We each had our own rock hammer. The next time we're up that way, we might have to hit some of those spots and let mt kids get a taste. We've got boxes of fossils, but they've never dug their own.
Ah yes. The old fallacy, Argument from self inflicted smashed fingers.
"My fingers are bruised and bleeding from repeated self inflicted hammer blows. Therefore god exists.
It's in the bible somewhere, which you would know if you read it more."
Two things:
First, I signed up for this event last week and stopped by my local Ax-Man Surplus store to see if they had any possible tools I could pick up, and sure enough, they have great dental devices, varius brushes, magnifying lenses, collection boxes, and small hammers. I can't remember ever having a science hobby itch they couldn't help me scratch.
Second, the following week the Twin Cities Creationist Association has a fossil-hunting event planned for the same location. So maybe if the atheists clean all the fossils out, the fundies will assume the fossils just went back to hell whence they came.
Too bad: We'll be out of town. But we plan to take our kids there for fossiling later in the summer.
I miss fossil hunting. I used to find them *everywhere* when I lived in the Lower Peninsula of Michigan. But now, I'm in the Upper Peninsula, in an area where the glaciers scraped everything down to the pre-cambrian bedrock. The only fossils around here are the ones that people import.
Keep an eye out for relics of the elusive Crocoduck. They must get a winner one day.
@Hank - they require a permit for the Lilydale brickyards location, it's something like $10/group and is easily obtained here http://www.stpaul.gov/index.asp?NID=1560. There is another good site at the west end of Summit Ave on the bluffs of the Mississippi - a lovely location and open to the public.
SplendidMonkey@24
Are permits for groups? Are solo hunters required to get one these days? It's been a while since I was down there.
Checked the link, questions answered, nevermind, kthxby.
It looks like it's $10 for individual or small group and $25 for larger groups. I don't think they do much permit checking and there's no office or checkpoint to get in there.
Where I live in Bath, England, the entire city is a fossil. Virtually every building is built from the local oolitic limestone, which formed from a Jurassic sea bed. If you go up to any wall, you can see shell fragments buried within it. Whilst taking a rock chisel to the local architecture is generally frowned upon, there are plenty of rock fragments to be found in the fields surrounding the city.
By the way PZ, the troll Robert pops up from time to time in the comments. I'm not sure how far back he goes, but it's possible you picked him up during Crackergate. He's very much a one-trick pony, with every post being a cockeyed personal attack on you. Like the above specimen, he attempts to be cruel and spiteful, but merely comes across as childish and weird.
My parents took my kids there last time we were in MN visiting. They had a great time!
Wait, 440-480 million year old marine fossils? I thought the world was only 6,000 years old?
A wonderful place to hunt fossils for west-coasters is Ano Nuevo state park, just north of Santa Cruz, CA. There are a lot of sea-washed black rocks with shell fossils embedded in them, and they have a greater variety and diversity than other local beaches. Plus the scenery isn't bad, although it's windy.
I'm not clear on whether or not it's lawful to take fossils from a state park, so I don't. Whether or not they can be taken, though, they're absolutely amazing - scallop shells as old as time, the odd spiral-shell fragment buried in rock (nautilus, maybe?), other such things.
I hope everybody understands the rule: All human bones or artifacts found from that "time period" are to be thrown out, or put into the back rooms and secure vaults of our atheist institutions.
You may be tempted to gain fame and fortune from the human remains mixed in with "prehistoric fossils," but you know it's not worth it. You'll have to acknowledge god, and your responsibility to god, if you do. And we all know, admitting that is just not worth it, compared to our lives of sin and debauchery.
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/6mb592
Ranson @ 18
That is so cool. I've got to get my kids down there.
Hey, I'm an atheist, how come I don't get any of that debauchery?! That sounds like fun and now I feel like a victim, wah, wah.
tceisele @ #22-- a fellow Michigander! Having lived and traveled in both da UP and below da bridge, I know what you mean. Glaciers did strange things to Michigan's geology. We get the Canadian Shield at 3 billion years+ and mastodons at 25,000 BCE but not a lot in the middle except for the Devonian stuff around the edges: crinoids and horn corals and bivalves, oh my.
tceisele @ 22
What no creationists fossils? They are lying(sic) all over the place!
A shame I won't be able to join them, but I'll have to look into that dig site in general. I haven't gone fossil hunting in years, and I've really been meaning to.
I used to collect ammonites around Lake Benbrook in Fort Worth. It was the first time I could take my older kids out and show them the realities of life on earth. They were laying out on the banks of the lake easy to pick up. The fossils that is.
It was great fun! I wish they were more prominant where I live now.
Trilobites I found in the area were mostly enrolled. Keep that in mind. Look in the loose debris.
I love this phrasing. It makes me think that the trolls are like ticks, picked up during the writing of blog entries, which might be the internet equivalent of walking through tall grass on Cape Cod.
oooooh. Fun. Drives me batty that there are so many creationists in KY when one drives past millions of years of history every day, with roads cut through our rolling hills. All you have to do is look, but creationists either refuse to take this first step, or the second, looking it up and learning.
RE: #40 Josh <\I>
Well, both trolls and ticks infest areas requiring eradication efforts.
@Robster
That's what I'm saying. I grew up in southern WV -- every single road is cut from the side of a mountain, and all that science and history is right there. Added to all the shale and coal fossils, anyone in that area has to be in real denial to reject the evidence.
you're gonna have to go to another planet to find your fossils dudes...
after all, everybody know's the earth is only 6000 years old (and 14 hours and 27 minutes)
“Monday Metazoan”? “Irish Atheists Need Help”? “Local Fossil Hunting”? Is that all there is today? Is this Pharyngula? Come on! Put up something controversial and outrageous. I’m 65 years old, sitting at home, and bored.
Geez, this is becoming like Slashdot with the dumb obligatory comments.
In Soviet Russia, fossils dig *you* up!
Put up something controversial and outrageous. I’m 65 years old, sitting at home, and bored.
How about this?
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9846O402&show_article=1
Saudi judge says it's OK for men to beat their wives.
It's the 21st century!
Not that I've looked deeply into creations, er, "science", it's been my understanding that they just think all those cool layers formed very quickly. Or something. They don't ignore it, they just make up... alternate explanations.
Rock hammers (or any other special tools) not really required, so feel free to join us. Many of the fossils are located in the topsoil and are easily found with a bit of looking around. The terrain is a bit hilly, so good foot wear is a must.
Michigander #35
The husband of a Michigoose?
And I am not suggesting possibility 3, except if you're from 'the other' mob:
gan·der (gndr)
n.
1. A male goose.
2. Informal A look or glance: "Everyone turns and takes a gander at the yokels" Garrison Keillor.
3. Informal A simpleton; a ninny.
When I was a lad of ten or so, my siblings and I used to go fossil hunting on our own property in southeast Kansas. A creek had cut into a soft rock bank full of interesting marine fossils. We dug out something that looked just like a lamprey eel or some such squishy thing (I forget which). Years later I read that no fossilized whatever-it-was had ever been found, as they are too soft. The fossil was long lost, along with my chances for glory and fame. Which nonsense is just to say that fossil-hunting is great fun for all ages, and leaves lasting memories, if a trifle blurred by time.
One of my sisters went on to become a geologist. I was with her on her first trip into the Grand Canyon. She was in heaven, especially when she found a genuine, old-style rock hammer in an abandoned mine. She regretfully left the hammer behind, as we had five days of heavy hiking ahead of us. When we got back to civilization, Brad pulled the hammer out of his pack and gave it to her.
Soviet Russia this is where i comment on your dumb obligatory flame...
How long before the state senate proposes a bill whereby Ax man can refuse to sell rock hammers on conscience grounds?
There's few things as satisfying that getting something that old out of ground with your own hands.
Soviet Russia this is where i comment on your dumb obligatory flame...
Huh?
No, no, no. You come back with something about a Beowulf cluster of fossils, or maybe a "Stupid, stupid fossil creatures!" or rephrase the whole thing as a car analogy.
am i the only one who read the headline as "Lolcat fossil hunting"?
(i can haz tranzishinul formz?)
First off, we're just doing this to have some fun with fellow atheists, so if you're not into it, don't go! :)
Second, yes, you need a permit, and it's the cool thing to follow the rules on the permits to help maintain the parks. They have permits for under 10 people and for more than 10 people. So if you can count to ten, you're good to figure out which one you need.
Third, it's just nice for us pasty nerds to have a reason to get ourselves outside, okay? :) Hope to see some new faces there!
Since when are biologists allowed rock hammers? Stick to the squishy things and leave the rocks to the geologists. :)
Hey #50, that's just the odd name residents of MI have for ourselves. Simpler than Michiganian-- no gender or waterfowl involved.
It's a little late, but here's a piece of comedy I did about the Puijila darmini fossil and Star Trek.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdkNHdnV_0s